Okay, hear me out, Chuck. Jokes aside. What if you don't have much stamina and blow your load like two seconds in? There's gotta be a place for us who can't elevate tension, no?
As always, how can you take your weakness and spin it as a plus? Once a friend in workshop brought a story in which she'd written everything very quickly and superficially. It all read with the same even tone, where events came and went with no building tension. One proposed idea was to lean into the speed of it and call the story "Pitch" as if she were delivering the plot pitch for a move or whatnot.
I am overjoyed to read your comments on a piece of writing. I applaud the hell out of someone for submitting this to be reviewed and thank them for sharing. I appreciate Frank’s bludgeoning to death while being taught a lesson about productivity and efficiency with such brutality. Does the author work for UPS? Amazon? Well done.
This is an unrelated, general question. And it might be a dumb one but I'm curious.
When you review a student's work that might contain some harmful messages, would you ever bring it to their attention to let them know? And have you done something similar in the past?
Geez, I don't know. During in-person workshops I rely on other people to address content. I'll veer toward always addressing craft. It's such a slippery slope, and most cheap shots are pretty obvious to everyone. That's the new cringe, when writers hammer on their political opinion in detriment to the overall effect of the story. In all things -- be subtle, seduce us.
I imagined you starting your critique of a story like this. "In your piece, after the babysitter castrates the young narrator and feeds him his own flesh, and then gets away with it, try to use fewer thought verbs and go on the body more."
If we meet, I'm gonna be in wrapping paper and bust out and say "I'm the present!" and then I'm gonna go for that big hug and whisper things like, "You're a gift to the world." And, "You're more precious than a Virgin Rainbow."
I googled the most valuable gemstone and found that.
I like how you made me wonder--what the hell is this place??! The first paragraph, I could see it, but the machine gun in the second paragraph threw me off/made me question myself--not in a bad way, just kept my curiosity.
By the middle, I understood that we were in some type of Amazon warehouse hellhole, with a mega-ass for a boss. One thing I wondered though was did whoever was manning the machine gun change? Correct me if I'm wrong, but at the beginning, I thought the machine gun was used to keep the workers working. As a fear tactic. Then at the end, I got the sense that someone else jumped in. But my question is, who? Maybe I missed something, but it could be fun to have the narrator hint at who is behind the gun at the end taking the man down. Or maybe it is, the narrator who jumped in?
You put a lot of good sounds/tastes/smells in this. I always forget the other senses besides sight, so nice work.
And I especially enjoyed the mention of the narrator's morning puking routine. Thought that was unique. Along with the line, "everyone had a morning ritual."
And I loved this line too: “That’s not an injury—just wear and tear of the job.”
I like the ball busting at the end with the steel toe. The steel toe is a good detail I think.
Good suggestions from Chuck. Looking forward to seeing where you take this!
The being told it was wear and tear of the job was a real thing that happened to me. I remember laying down on the trailer floor because my back hurt so bad and I couldn’t move. Boxes kept pouring in around me.
No, I meant baldy. When you clearly state something into existence you don't allow the reader to gradually recognize it. This raises the odds that the reader won't retain the new element. Otherwise, bald is sexy. Recessions are sexy. Go with it.
I agree with you! I like your stripper analogy. You want them to take off their clothes piece by piece, not just flop out their sausage and say, "here it is, end of story."
I love these posts. There's so much useful info for people trying to improve their writing. For example, making things less abstract. Instead of five minutes (abstract), it's the time it took his last cigarette to burn on its own. Thanks for continuing to share this info.
Chuck, I love your strategy of avoiding tennis match dialogue and using evasive responses to create or maintain tension. Are there any situations where a direct answer is permissible? Maybe to add some variety to the story.
In the Chuck World only the reader should be able to give a direct answer. The reader should be shouting at the page, "Because you're a douche!" while the characters avoid stating that fact.
Maybe I'm the only one but when I click on the link to read the story it takes me to a google drive or something with Chuck's comments? I'm probably just doing it wrong...hahaha...story of my life.
Love the Gloves Off segment. I feel like its my chance to be in that condemned house sitting around a lopsided formica table back in the 80s (or 90s?) listening to Tom Spanbauer deconstructing a work followed by homemade sandwiches and wine from a cardboard box...of course, I'm probably imaginging it wrong....in my head it plays like an 1980s John Hughes movie interpretation of a Michael Chabon book starring Brad Pitt as Chuck...hahahaha...now that's a movie I'd watch.
I have been noticing something. It seems like our culture has gotten more transgressive overall. Things have become more accepted or at the very least, tolerated. Shocking doesn't seem that shocking anymore. Is it just me? And if that's the cast, does that mean we have to be more provocative in our writing to compete?
One option is to create stories in which "cringe" or emotional pain is very present. Instead of wrecking property or breaking taboos, why not depict people in deeply vulnerable situations. For example, dying Chloe in Fight Club, begging anyone to have sex with her. Create circumstances where characters lose face and get rejected and humiliated -- yet still survive. That's most people's worst fear.
Yes, I like that answer! It's like that whole debate about stories that glorify the narrator and make him look like the cool guy and all that, versus, stories where the narrator loses face and gets humiliated. The latter seems way more powerful and requires WAY more courage than the former.
Thank you.
Good job, Logan. I appreciated your sound effect words. SMASH! WHACK! They made me think of Batman comics lol
Thanks
Okay, hear me out, Chuck. Jokes aside. What if you don't have much stamina and blow your load like two seconds in? There's gotta be a place for us who can't elevate tension, no?
As always, how can you take your weakness and spin it as a plus? Once a friend in workshop brought a story in which she'd written everything very quickly and superficially. It all read with the same even tone, where events came and went with no building tension. One proposed idea was to lean into the speed of it and call the story "Pitch" as if she were delivering the plot pitch for a move or whatnot.
Hmmmmmm
I am overjoyed to read your comments on a piece of writing. I applaud the hell out of someone for submitting this to be reviewed and thank them for sharing. I appreciate Frank’s bludgeoning to death while being taught a lesson about productivity and efficiency with such brutality. Does the author work for UPS? Amazon? Well done.
I work for their competitor.
The benefits must be.... killer.
I'm never going to use the words lay or lied for the rest of my life. Nope. I'm avoiding that confusion lol
I know? Hang, hanged or hung? Ugh.
This is an unrelated, general question. And it might be a dumb one but I'm curious.
When you review a student's work that might contain some harmful messages, would you ever bring it to their attention to let them know? And have you done something similar in the past?
Geez, I don't know. During in-person workshops I rely on other people to address content. I'll veer toward always addressing craft. It's such a slippery slope, and most cheap shots are pretty obvious to everyone. That's the new cringe, when writers hammer on their political opinion in detriment to the overall effect of the story. In all things -- be subtle, seduce us.
I imagined you starting your critique of a story like this. "In your piece, after the babysitter castrates the young narrator and feeds him his own flesh, and then gets away with it, try to use fewer thought verbs and go on the body more."
I'm sorry I'm just being ridiculous lol
Wow, those all sound like great tips! Thanks, Chuck, for letting us all read these. Gonna save and re-read, and hopefully learn how to apply 'em...
Chuck's critiques are wonderful. They are like being touched by a fatherly figure in a loving but non-traumatic way.
Boundaries. Geez, I even hate hugs.
What is with you hating things? You hate compliments, gifts, and now hugs. Let people love you!
Sheesh lol
If we meet, I'm gonna be in wrapping paper and bust out and say "I'm the present!" and then I'm gonna go for that big hug and whisper things like, "You're a gift to the world." And, "You're more precious than a Virgin Rainbow."
I googled the most valuable gemstone and found that.
I hope I'm not too annoying. I feel like I annoy you and I apologize.
I’ll be revising with these comments in mind. These comments will definitely take the story to the next level.
Specifying the packages raining down is a fantastic idea.
Thanks for sharing Logan, there are so many good elements in this story that you can really tease out to take it to the next level.
Hi Logan! Thanks for letting us read your story.
I like how you made me wonder--what the hell is this place??! The first paragraph, I could see it, but the machine gun in the second paragraph threw me off/made me question myself--not in a bad way, just kept my curiosity.
By the middle, I understood that we were in some type of Amazon warehouse hellhole, with a mega-ass for a boss. One thing I wondered though was did whoever was manning the machine gun change? Correct me if I'm wrong, but at the beginning, I thought the machine gun was used to keep the workers working. As a fear tactic. Then at the end, I got the sense that someone else jumped in. But my question is, who? Maybe I missed something, but it could be fun to have the narrator hint at who is behind the gun at the end taking the man down. Or maybe it is, the narrator who jumped in?
You put a lot of good sounds/tastes/smells in this. I always forget the other senses besides sight, so nice work.
And I especially enjoyed the mention of the narrator's morning puking routine. Thought that was unique. Along with the line, "everyone had a morning ritual."
And I loved this line too: “That’s not an injury—just wear and tear of the job.”
I like the ball busting at the end with the steel toe. The steel toe is a good detail I think.
Good suggestions from Chuck. Looking forward to seeing where you take this!
Hi, Meagan! (Heil Meagan!)
Hi, Deep! How are ya?
(psst. it's MAE-gan. ;) )
I know I was using burnt tongue.
🙀
😹😹
Hahahaha! You sneaky devil you!
YOU'RE NEXT!!
*runs away*
The being told it was wear and tear of the job was a real thing that happened to me. I remember laying down on the trailer floor because my back hurt so bad and I couldn’t move. Boxes kept pouring in around me.
I think that’s why I was drawn to it. It felt like it came from someplace real.
"jingjing! bring us back something real!"
Yeah, and my ops manager basically laughed me out of his office.
I’m sorry you had to go through that.
I’m looking for a new line of work.
The machine gun is sort on a automatic timer. Frank was just at the wrong place at the wrong time.
I'm not worthy of critiquing your language-piece. Can you please forgive me?
Chuck, you wrote, "Next, don’t name the machine gun turret so baldy..."
Did you mean boldly? Otherwise, as a person who is follically-impaired, I will take offense!
LOL
No, I meant baldy. When you clearly state something into existence you don't allow the reader to gradually recognize it. This raises the odds that the reader won't retain the new element. Otherwise, bald is sexy. Recessions are sexy. Go with it.
I agree with you! I like your stripper analogy. You want them to take off their clothes piece by piece, not just flop out their sausage and say, "here it is, end of story."
And my balding head liked your comment.
I love these posts. There's so much useful info for people trying to improve their writing. For example, making things less abstract. Instead of five minutes (abstract), it's the time it took his last cigarette to burn on its own. Thanks for continuing to share this info.
An excellent example. The time it takes a hot cup of coffee to go cold. How long before Havarti cheese breaks out in those icky red spots.
So, a more organic way of telling time?
Chuck, I love your strategy of avoiding tennis match dialogue and using evasive responses to create or maintain tension. Are there any situations where a direct answer is permissible? Maybe to add some variety to the story.
In the Chuck World only the reader should be able to give a direct answer. The reader should be shouting at the page, "Because you're a douche!" while the characters avoid stating that fact.
Maybe I'm the only one but when I click on the link to read the story it takes me to a google drive or something with Chuck's comments? I'm probably just doing it wrong...hahaha...story of my life.
Love the Gloves Off segment. I feel like its my chance to be in that condemned house sitting around a lopsided formica table back in the 80s (or 90s?) listening to Tom Spanbauer deconstructing a work followed by homemade sandwiches and wine from a cardboard box...of course, I'm probably imaginging it wrong....in my head it plays like an 1980s John Hughes movie interpretation of a Michael Chabon book starring Brad Pitt as Chuck...hahahaha...now that's a movie I'd watch.
Thanks for sharing Logan, and looking forward to what you make from the feedback.
I enjoyed seeing the breakdown of how to handle the t-shirt description, like the is/has/was problem and how to avoid it makes more sense to me now.
I do plan on sharing the revised version when it’s done.
I have been noticing something. It seems like our culture has gotten more transgressive overall. Things have become more accepted or at the very least, tolerated. Shocking doesn't seem that shocking anymore. Is it just me? And if that's the cast, does that mean we have to be more provocative in our writing to compete?
Let's just sit with that question for a bit.
One option is to create stories in which "cringe" or emotional pain is very present. Instead of wrecking property or breaking taboos, why not depict people in deeply vulnerable situations. For example, dying Chloe in Fight Club, begging anyone to have sex with her. Create circumstances where characters lose face and get rejected and humiliated -- yet still survive. That's most people's worst fear.
Yes, I like that answer! It's like that whole debate about stories that glorify the narrator and make him look like the cool guy and all that, versus, stories where the narrator loses face and gets humiliated. The latter seems way more powerful and requires WAY more courage than the former.