Slightly off topic... Chuck are you watching this season of Succession? The dialog! Omg. Kendall speaks in largely strung together sport’s metaphors. Roman is either profane or sexual or both. Shiv always demurs, never definitive. I never noticed them being so pronounced. It’s not Mamet and yet it kind of is. If you’re watching... I’d love to hear what you have to say about it.
Shiv didn't demur in episode 5: while kicking dirt on Tom's perfectly white sneakers, she emasculates him with: "Your shoes are like looking at the sun…This is why people don't take you seriously, because your shoes are so white."
And with the Swede, giving him PR advice: “If you’re the creepy stalker guy who sits in the dark writing code and dripping into an IV bag and harassing your direct reports, it’s going to have an economic impact.” ... “Deniability is difficult given she has so much of your blood.”
We loved playing "Hi, Bob"; every moment sizzled with possibility.
And yes, as a longtime copy editor (in my day job), I am all too familiar with echoes, repetition, and accidental rhymes. However, I do not hate all writers who stet those queries most times.
1. The dead girl game shows up in The Stud Book, and while it starts as a drinking game, i love how it teases a massive plot point.
2. A friend of mine is finishing a program in copyediting, and I offered her one of my short stories to use for her portfolio. Tank, with the burn guy and the paint. OMG I drove her crazy with my repeating verbs!
There's a small part of me that feels bad for her and the work she put in and how much I'll have to dismiss and justify, but there's another part that gets off that I'm implementing tech correctly.
I love Tank! Is it bad to get pleasure of other people's misery while not being a cenobite? If anything you are giving her a true test of the extremes.
I guess it sometimes just depends on the day of the week. I hope to have copyeditor's that I can annoy someday. Though on Scott suggestion I did get "The Chicago Guide to Copyediting Fiction" by Amy J. Schneider. I guess you need to learn the the rules before you give your copyeditor ulcers or premature hair loss.
Sounds like most CEs are prescriptive grammarians. Fine for non-fiction and other academic stuff. Fictioneers probably use a more descriptive grammar, but that might be hard to know after editors have had their way with the copy.
I would agree that echos tend to cut a reader's attention, so I cut them :)
As far as rhymes go: they've been slipping into sentences like cars in a row. But it's my protagonist's fault. I'm just a stenographer trapped in a vault.
We tried playing drink any time "Bob" was mentioned. We picked the episode when they were thinking of naming their son "Bob". We lasted about ten minutes.
In grad school, I improved on the local drinking game by having everyone do a shot AND call their House Representative or Senator. Because I believe in democracy, damnit! And I cracked up imagining the poor interns listening to our drunk dials. The local game was spinning a little cup in a bucket full of beer while pouring in beer to the little cup, and if you sunk the little cup, you had to rescue it and drink it empty. It was not nearly as complicated as it sounds. The calling your elected official, though, that can be done with any drinking game!
In addition to toning down the inner rhyme that slips into my sentences, I find I also have to prune all the alliteration in my prose. Sometimes, it’s nice to just write in a voice that completely embraces my alliterative inner rhyming tendencies!
How do editors feel about alliteration? For some reason I love to use it, tastefully of course. Especially with sibilant words.
Also, have you ever play Drink While You Think, aka The Name Game? It’s a clockwise game where you say the name of someone famous, someone everyone agrees upon as a confirmed celebrity. It can be a fictional character, but at least one person must confirm the name. The next person must come up with another celebrity’s name based upon the first letter of the last name of the preceding entry. For example, Chuck Palahniuk - Patsy Cline. You must drink until you say a name. Matching first and last initials reverses the turn to the previous player. Those reversals turn into heavy volleys very quickly. It’s a lot of fun, and a good way to get far drunker than you intended.
I majored in English language drama, and during my time in college I read most all of Tennessee Williams. As I read Suddenly Last Summer, I realized that one of two nightmares I had my whole life was actually a film production of the play which I caught on tv as a youngster.
The white suit, screaming, birds, children...
My other nightmare is that a red monster of a wolf howls in a red-skyed apocalypse, from the top of a craggy cliff. Ever since first grade. If you have any ideas how to get rid of it I'd love to hear them.
GReat. Tahnk you!
awesome sauce
thank you again
Slightly off topic... Chuck are you watching this season of Succession? The dialog! Omg. Kendall speaks in largely strung together sport’s metaphors. Roman is either profane or sexual or both. Shiv always demurs, never definitive. I never noticed them being so pronounced. It’s not Mamet and yet it kind of is. If you’re watching... I’d love to hear what you have to say about it.
Shiv didn't demur in episode 5: while kicking dirt on Tom's perfectly white sneakers, she emasculates him with: "Your shoes are like looking at the sun…This is why people don't take you seriously, because your shoes are so white."
And with the Swede, giving him PR advice: “If you’re the creepy stalker guy who sits in the dark writing code and dripping into an IV bag and harassing your direct reports, it’s going to have an economic impact.” ... “Deniability is difficult given she has so much of your blood.”
You’re right! Such great scenes. I have a MS with 5 character and I’m working to keep them separated.
What do you do if you’re teetotal? Add some more sugar to your tea?
Hot sauce shots!
Or snorting cayenne! (I’m told is also effective for curing migraines).
Probably burns so badly in the nose you don’t notice the pain anymore...
Most topical pepper creams work this way, burning and tingling skin distracts from the pain in muscles and joints underneath
That sounds diabolical. I’m in
Yes Chuck.
Yes Chuck.
We loved playing "Hi, Bob"; every moment sizzled with possibility.
And yes, as a longtime copy editor (in my day job), I am all too familiar with echoes, repetition, and accidental rhymes. However, I do not hate all writers who stet those queries most times.
Two lil bits:
1. The dead girl game shows up in The Stud Book, and while it starts as a drinking game, i love how it teases a massive plot point.
2. A friend of mine is finishing a program in copyediting, and I offered her one of my short stories to use for her portfolio. Tank, with the burn guy and the paint. OMG I drove her crazy with my repeating verbs!
There's a small part of me that feels bad for her and the work she put in and how much I'll have to dismiss and justify, but there's another part that gets off that I'm implementing tech correctly.
How do you feel about that?
I love Tank! Is it bad to get pleasure of other people's misery while not being a cenobite? If anything you are giving her a true test of the extremes.
Oh god, Pinhead is so burned into my memory from when I was a little kid.
It's less that I enjoy her struggling and nitpicking, and more that her nitpicking is a biproduct of being successful stylistically.
And Tank has so far received very kind, personalized rejections from magazines, so I like it too.
Just think of where you will be in 10-20 years. It will be amazing! So good.
Prompt: write from the POV of your favorite cenobite.
Excellent idea! Funny story. That is what I am bringing to workshop tomorrow.
I guess it sometimes just depends on the day of the week. I hope to have copyeditor's that I can annoy someday. Though on Scott suggestion I did get "The Chicago Guide to Copyediting Fiction" by Amy J. Schneider. I guess you need to learn the the rules before you give your copyeditor ulcers or premature hair loss.
Sounds like most CEs are prescriptive grammarians. Fine for non-fiction and other academic stuff. Fictioneers probably use a more descriptive grammar, but that might be hard to know after editors have had their way with the copy.
I would agree that echos tend to cut a reader's attention, so I cut them :)
As far as rhymes go: they've been slipping into sentences like cars in a row. But it's my protagonist's fault. I'm just a stenographer trapped in a vault.
https://osuwritingcenter.okstate.edu/blog/2020/10/30/prescriptive-and-descriptive-grammar
We tried playing drink any time "Bob" was mentioned. We picked the episode when they were thinking of naming their son "Bob". We lasted about ten minutes.
In grad school, I improved on the local drinking game by having everyone do a shot AND call their House Representative or Senator. Because I believe in democracy, damnit! And I cracked up imagining the poor interns listening to our drunk dials. The local game was spinning a little cup in a bucket full of beer while pouring in beer to the little cup, and if you sunk the little cup, you had to rescue it and drink it empty. It was not nearly as complicated as it sounds. The calling your elected official, though, that can be done with any drinking game!
In addition to toning down the inner rhyme that slips into my sentences, I find I also have to prune all the alliteration in my prose. Sometimes, it’s nice to just write in a voice that completely embraces my alliterative inner rhyming tendencies!
"Hell, do it anyway."
Words to live by.
Thanks, Chuck. 😊
How do editors feel about alliteration? For some reason I love to use it, tastefully of course. Especially with sibilant words.
Also, have you ever play Drink While You Think, aka The Name Game? It’s a clockwise game where you say the name of someone famous, someone everyone agrees upon as a confirmed celebrity. It can be a fictional character, but at least one person must confirm the name. The next person must come up with another celebrity’s name based upon the first letter of the last name of the preceding entry. For example, Chuck Palahniuk - Patsy Cline. You must drink until you say a name. Matching first and last initials reverses the turn to the previous player. Those reversals turn into heavy volleys very quickly. It’s a lot of fun, and a good way to get far drunker than you intended.
Repetition should be in every writer's toolbox. Sorry, copy editors (not sorry)
I doubt anyone will ever read this, but:
I majored in English language drama, and during my time in college I read most all of Tennessee Williams. As I read Suddenly Last Summer, I realized that one of two nightmares I had my whole life was actually a film production of the play which I caught on tv as a youngster.
The white suit, screaming, birds, children...
My other nightmare is that a red monster of a wolf howls in a red-skyed apocalypse, from the top of a craggy cliff. Ever since first grade. If you have any ideas how to get rid of it I'd love to hear them.